Talk:Seddie/@comment-3247345-20121020091802
So people have been talking about what they think about Carly and I figured I'd post what I think. First off on I like her a little more than neutral. On a scale of 1-10 with one being absolute hate, 10 being worship and 5 being neutral I'd be a 6. I do like Sam and Spencer better. I also like Freddie better when he's not being a douchebag to Sam. When he is I like Carly better than him. We should keep in mind what Carly has done for Seddie (mostly in iDSaF). She's even funny on rare occasions. That's the positive. There's also the negative. She can be annoying, she gets everything handed to her, and she's a priss. Some of these things have gotten better over time but they're all still problems. Then there's her selfish streak. Yeah, I'm saying it. When people call her selfish they're right. I want to qualify this statement by saying that if she had the chance to do something for Sam or Freddie that doesn't go against her own self interest I think she would do it. But if it went against her self interest she wouldn't do it. Let's review Carly's selfish behavior throughout the series, shall we? iPromise Not To Tell is first on the list. At first glance Sam might appear to the selfish one here. After all shew was demanding that Carly and Freddie not rat her out for breaking the rules. A closer look shows that's not the case. Sam broke the rules to help Carly. Carly got gipped out of an A by an unreasonable teacher and Sam just put things back the way they were supposed to be. Carly then promised Sam she wouldn't rat. Then she got all this guilt over something she shouldn't have been guilty about. This guilt seems to be driven by her need to be snitch, even in cases where technically breaking the rules sets things right. But the important thing here is that she promised Sam she wouldn't tell and then broke her promise just to assuage her misplaced guilt. Fulfilling her impulse to snitch was more important than keeping the promise she made to Sam. Selfish much? Next up is iDon't want to fight. In this episode Sam gave up something Carly gave her, something that was all hers, for something her and Carly could do together. Carly was totally wrong in this fight but she cared more about being right than appreciating what Sam did for her. Not only selfish but ungrateful. iSaw him first is a classic example of Carly's selfish behavior. To be fair both girls were putting a guy over their friendship. But what really got me is when Sam Carly kissed Shane after they agreed not to fight over a guy. Winning was more important than her friendship with Sam. She cared more about making sure she one upped Sam than anything else. iLook Alike is a great example of how selfish she is vis-a-vis Spencer. Again, I'll be fair here. Spencer was being a kill joy and a control freak in this episode. The fact that he agreed with Freddie's mother is a testament to this. But let's look at what Spencer usually does for Carly. He's the best guardian ever. He's fun and he basically lets her do what she pleases. He spent $82,000 on a new room for her. Granted he hadn't done that yet at the time the episode aired but it gives you an idea of what he's willing to do for Carly. He gives her everything she wants. The one time he doesn't give her what she want she goes apeshit. This is a symptom of Carly's all about me attitude. If she doesn't get what she wants all the time it's the end of the world. Maybe Spencer was being unreasonable in this particular case, but the way she reacted to being told no one time after getting what she wants every other time is really telling about Carly's attitude. Let's talk about iReunite with Missy now. As you probably know I wish Sam would have killed Missy. This may look like a case of Carly putting Missy's needs over Sam's. It is, but in another sense it's Carly being selfish. Imagine that. I haven't even reached the end of season 2 and I've found all this stuff and Carly's being selfish AGAIN. Surprised? Me neither. Back to how Carly was selfish in this episode. Essentially she was putting her wants (her want to go back to being best friends with Missy) over Sam's needs (to be listened to her by her best friend). iThink They Kissed is nothing major as far as Carly's selfishness goes. Her need to be aware of everything that goes on between her friends is kind of selfish but it's pretty minor compared to other episodes. Strangely enough there's nothing noteworthy about iQuit iCarly. iGot a Hot Room doesn't really show Carly being selfish but it does give us a hint as to why she feels so entitled to get everything she wants. For a minute it it looks like the girl who has every good thing imaginable showered upon from the heavens actually has something bad happen to her. But it's just temporary. Spencer spent all $82,000 of the insurance check on her room. It's not like it was an investment either. They rent the place so any increase in the value of the loft would be of no benefit to Spencer. You can start to see why some people might call Carly a spoiled brat. I don't necessarily agree with this but as you can see this accusation is far from baseless. iLost my mind has no important selfish moments for Carly but someone who refuses to see Carly for what she is might point to her getting Sam and Freddie together as proof she isn't selfish. This was certainly admirable but let's keep in mind Carly doesn't have feelings for Freddie so it doesn't cost her a thing to get him together with Sam. This is consistent with what I said at the top of this comment. Carly will do something nice for Sam and Fredddie that doesn't benefit her if it doesn't go against her self interest. It's important to note that at the time Carly could not have predicted what Seddie would end up costing her in subsequent episodes. As far as she knew getting Sam and Freddie together was cost free when she did it. But as we'll see as soon as it inconviences her she'll break them up no matter how much it hurts Sam or Freddie. iDate Sam and Freddie is the start of the build up to the most selfish act Carly will ever commit (which she does in iCan't Take It but let's not get ahead of ourselves here). Two main things are important in this episode. First is how upset Carly is that Freddie focused the camera on Sam instead of her. Isn't it horrible that Freddie focused his attention on Sam? It's not like he's dating her or anything. Oh wait, he is. The most important part of this is that Carly wasn't the center of attention and that's not okay with Carly. Again, everything has to be about Carly. The other major selfish thing she does is the way she went off on Sam and Freddie at the end. I can understand why she was upset. It must be frustrating being dragged into your best friends' arguments. I'd actually be on Carly's side here if it weren't for two things. First of all she inserted herself into their first argument. This is on her. Second of all regardless of how she got involved she voluntarily went with Sam and Freddie on their date and she knew that it was almost guaranteed that Sam and Freddie would get into a fight. Having volunteered to go she knew she would be asked to solve it. Look Carly, either solve their fights or don't but don't be a biotch about it when they ask you to do what you implicitly agreed to when you went with them. iCan't Take it has one major and one minor selfish thing Carly does. I'll start with the minor thing since we all know the major thing. She demands to be able to go with Sam and Freddie to the movie. Unlike with the trip to Pini's she wasn't invited. Sam and Freddi went on the date to focus on each other. But that's the thing. They're not focusing on Carly and Carly has a problem with that. This is just more of this all about me attitude Carly has. Then of course Carly's most selfish act ever. She tells Freddie's control freak mom and that little weasel Gibby about the NERD camp thing. Seddie was inconveniencing her so she broke them up. Sam's first relationship where they guy didn't leave her and all Carly cares about is that it inconveniences her. That's the ultimate act of selfishness. She didn't care about Sam or Freddie's happiness, just her own. Not only that but she chose Sam and Freddie getting hurt really bad over her being inconvenienced a little. She couldn't even sacrifice a small amount of her happiness so Sam and Freddie could be with their true love (she knew Sam loved Freddie Freddie hadn't admitted he loved Sam yet). Because it's all about Carly. She does end up doing the right thing to be sure, but given her history of being selfish both before and after this episode you do have to wonder if she did it for the right reasons. More on that later. iLove You is another example of Carly helping her friends when it doesn't cost her anything. I'm not going to put the blame on Carly for the Seddie break up because Sam and Freddie applied the message to themselves when they shouldn't have. Dan screwed up, not Carly. A word on iOpen a Restaurant. Carly was not selfish here because she didn't want Freddie. She's not going to throw Sam under the bus over something she doesn't want. If she wanted Freddie she would have taken him no matter what Sam thought. But she doesn't. This is why Creddie can't happen. Carly taking Sam's first love would destroy her character. But if she had feelings for Freddie she would go for it because she's selfish. Therefore Dan can't give Carly feelings for Freddie because he won't destroy her character. He can't give Carly a motive that would make her evil because she would act on it without regard to anyone else's feelings because it's all about Carly. iGet Banned is the the most recent example of Carly being selfish. Spencer has a broken leg and all she cares about is going on dates. All that Spencer has done for her doesn't matter in her calculations because it's all about Carly. Some people will point to Carly intervening to stop Sam and Freddie from breaking up as evidence that she's not selfish. From the the standpoint of Seddie and Sam and Freddie's happiness, Carly's true motives for doing that may not matter. But if the question is whether Carly is selfish, then her motives do matter. On the surface it appears that Carly sacrificed her own happiness for Sam and Freddie's. But look deeper. Carly's behavior before and after this epic moment in Seddie history has been consistenly selfish. We have way more than enough evidence to prove that selfishness is part of Carly's character. It would be OOC for Carly not to be selfish here. Maybe that's what happened. But maybe she really was being selfish. Maybe her motives weren't all that pure. There is a way she could stay in character and do what she did. The reasoning goes like this: Carly has an interest in making sure her friends stay togther. A break up, especially on those terms would have left the situation between Sam and Freddie awkward at best. That would have hurt the dynamic, affect Carly. Plus it would harm iCarly, something against Carly's self interest. So basically she wants Sam and Freddie to be happy but only because that will make her happy in the end. In short Carly's actions at the end of iCan't Take It were a recalculation of her own self interest rather than deciding to forgo her own happiness for that of her friends. Form your own conclusions about what kind of friend that makes Carly but I'll stay silent on the issue. Of course it's possible that Dan just made Carly OOC for the the sake of the plot. I just think that Dan is a better writer than that and that if there's an explanation that doesn't involve him doing that then it's probably true. I may be wrong but I'm most likely not. I'll end this where I started. My opinion of Carly is a little more favorable than neutral. But it's beyond question that Carly is selfish. That negatively impacts my opinion of her but in the end that's balanced out by positive factors such as her importance to the show, especially in keeping Sam and Freddie around each other long enough to become friends and eventually fall in love. My point is that Carly really is selfish. The record speaks for itself but I figured I'd point this out since some people seem to actually believe that she isn't selfish. One more thing. Don't try to compare pointing out a character's obvious flaws to the Sam hate that's become a constant in this fandom ever since Seddie became a true threat to Creddie. They're calling her a b**** for no reason or bashing her because she's in the way of Creddie. Most of the behavior these people object to can be explained by Sam's history and a modicum of psycology. Carly's selfishness is just that: selfishness. As Sam grows up a lot of the behaviors people complain about are going away yet the hate remains. That's pretty telling. Please don't try to equate the two. The Sam hate comparison is just a straw man. Man this a long comment.